clauclauclaudia | lyrics offensiveness

Everything below the cut is a query about how offensive some song lyrics are. Click or no, it's up to you.

Just try to see it, and you will soon agree, señors
Why invite regret, when you can get the sort of rape you'll never ever forget?

You can get the rape emphatic, you can get the rape polite
You can get the rape with Indians (a very charming sight)
You can get the rape on horseback, they all say it's new and gay!
So you see the sort of rape depends on what you pay,
It Depends On What You Pay

[Poll #892088]

Just try to see it, and you will soon agree, señors
Why invite regret, when you can order an abduction you will never forget?

An abduction that's emphatic, an abduction that's polite
An abduction done with Indians (a truly charming sight)
An abduction done on horseback, they all say it's new and gay!
So you see the sort of rape depends on what you pay,
It Depends On What You Pay

Okay, next question:

There were...
Hottentots with rotten tots and baskets on each mother's head
And Zulus, they concluded, never understood a thing they said
Effendis[okay, this word is wrong, anyone know what it is?] who were ganging up on natives who were being fed
And Swazi who were goosing all the Bushmen in the line ahead

It was dreadful!

The Pygmies had their noses stuck in everybody's business
While Watusis had their business stuck in everybody's nose
But the truth of the matter, if you really want to know
Was that everybody's business was about to decompose

[Poll #892089]

Last question...

Tell you about them sobbin' women who lived in the Roman days
It seems that they all went swimming while their men was off to graze
Well, a Roman troop was riding by and saw them in their me-oh-my
So they took them all back home to dry, least that's what Plutarch says

Oh, yes, them a-women was sobbin', sobbin', sobbin' fit to be tied
Every muscle was throbbin', throbbin' from that riotious ride
Seems they cried and kissed and kissed and cried
All over that Roman countryside
So don't forget that when you're taking a bride
Sobbin' fit to be tied, from that riotious ride

...

When their men folk went to fetch them the women would not be fetched
It seems when the Romans catch them their lady friends stay catched
Now, let this be, because it's true, a lesson to the likes of you
Rough them up like them there Romans do, or else they'll think you're tetched

[Poll #892090]

EDIT: Want context? Check my initial comment.

A friend found this modern re-enactment of the third song on youtube. It's notable for being an actual family of men, and for a slavish devotion to the original blocking and camera angles. Also, Cheryl explained the story context for it better than I did.

... this leads me to hunt youtube versions of the other songs: It Depends on What You Pay, A Difficult Transition

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I knew the context for the first; indeed (as you say), the context is explained before the song is sung. Because of that, I'm able to write off the potential offensiveness.

I did not know the context for the second song, but the outdated ethnic references came so fast and furious, I couldn't believe that offense could have been intended.

But that last one is inexcusable. Once upon a time, "Ann Landers" printed a couplet from a reader:

An egg, a horse, a wife are three
The more you beat 'em, the better they be

The writer offered to let "Ann" print his address, but she refused, predicting an avalanche of hate-mail. And sure enough, she got it.

Some attitudes are never "quaint".

Rememeber the time Ann reprinted a story a reader sent in which Ogg walloped Mrs Ogg for somethine, and when her readers wrote in to complain she said, "It was cute and funny! Lighten up!"?

I agree with you and Mark that some attitudes are never quaint, but I don't think there's any subject that cannot be joked about.

The question is whether it's a successful joke, and I think it's hard to judge that out of context. The three of us who so far said "hee" for the third song grew up loving the movie, and I think that's because we get the humor, but it could also be that we are inured to the inappropriateness. I wonder.

Having owned "Seven Brides for Seven Brothers" since I was old enough to own a movie, I am now forced to take a critical look at the song in question. Undoubtedly, without context the song is offensive. However, it is clear in context that the only person who thinks this approach to matrimony is acceptable is Adam (the guy singing the song). The song is based on his having heard his wife read the story of the Sabine women and his basic inability to empathise with anyone. As the movie unfolds, he is shown the error of his ways as are his brothers. so I guess it becomes a question of whether or not the end justifies the means. Even as a child seeing this movie, I never saw the scene which includes the above song and said, "By golly, I can't believe more men don't take this approach to courtship."

Also, for reference, when "The Fantastiks" was released in movie format, the "cleaned up version" of the abduction song was used. They cut out the rape version because they thought it might be offensive.

I have no experience at all with the second song,having never seen the play in question.

I knew that about the movie, but I haven't seen it because friends panned it for unrelated reasons.

Also, do check the youtube video I added a link to in my original post. :)

It's wretched.

The Fantasticks movie, or the Seven Brides home video?

The Fantasticks movie. You were wise to skip it.

That does seem to be the strong consensus.

The new lyrics are now the official lyrics. The author was on NPR some while ago discussing it. I suspect searching on NPR.org for fantasticks will find it.

Thanks for the tip... I'll take a look.

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